jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
Then YES.
-
Registration is disabled due to constant spammers. Email [email protected] and we will temporarily re-enable registration for you.
New League Discussion
- Thread starter NML
- Start date
Yankee151
Hot Girl Summer
I get that new owners would like a fresh start and a new league with their own teams (believe me I do, I created a Carpathian Baseball League for no reason earlier today and still haven't decided what team I want to manage for a 20 minute tutorial video) but as strong as that desire is, veteran players are also attached to their own teams as much. I think the WBL has had a long history of people making teams their own, and you don't have to be a fanfic writer like me to do so. Just a few of the teams who have gained unique stories and histories compared to their previous iterations, that weren't there at league start:
- Tony's Miami Manatees (formerly Key West)
- Travis' North Dakota Riggers (formerly I can't even remember)
- Sooner taking over Moscow, one of the more storied franchises, and making it his own
- Wooly taking over San Francisco and moving them to a chain restaurant in Canada
- Me taking over Buffalo, retaining all history, and giving them my own unique identity
- Me taking over Little Rock and turning it into a team with a unique identity (success TBD)
- Rutgers Mike coming back and revitalizing Berlin (good sign for other former owners who may want to bring their old teams back)
- Lloyd coming back and making Buffalo his own again
I’ll close with this:
I think new owners want to start fresh - I think that veteran owners who truly love their team and history can understand this. That’s the obvious thing that “the WBL is fine” crew maybe doesn’t think about.
If y’all can add them to the WBL effectively, that’s great. I don’t think it’ll happen but it’s great if it can.
If you are a current owner that would be interested in moving to a new league, just shoot me a PM. I won’t be doing anything in the near future as I’ll let the WBL crew have a chance to figure this out. But if a bunch of the current owners are up to switching (frankly, pretty much all of you said yes but I won’t hold you to it), then maybe that is the best move.
I won’t announce/create anything new for a couple days and see what happens with the WBL. This should be one of the (if not the top) most active areas of the forum. I’m hoping to recreate that, but I'm not gonna be petulant and actively sabotage the current league to make that happen. Hopefully y’all figure it out
I honestly don't get why you are all cloak and dagger about this shit? Private PMs? Why? You want to start a new league, start it! I'd play in ur league (and I'd play in the WBL). I hope you'd stay in the WBL too, now that u drafted two pitchers. Hell, maybe you could start a new player league and teams could earn promotion to the lofty WBL
I honestly think @Mr. Radpants is correct in stating that if we want new owners we probably need to look outside of Utopia. That goes for the WBL and NuWBL or whatever.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
If we're allowing people to take over teams and move them wherever, rebrand them, write their own fanfic why is an entirely new league necessary? Because other O's know their players and the new owner's don't? Well they're in luck because I have no clue who 90% of my starting roster is.
Karl Hungus
Here to fix the cable
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
Lol at owners that negotiate shadow governments like they do trades -- in the hidden world of PM. Post in public like a man.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
Just tweeted at Schilling again. Not giving up hope
Karl Hungus
Here to fix the cable
TonyGin&Juice
Sucking off Lawn Guy Land hobos.
Karl Hungus
Here to fix the cable
Who is this HOT ROD character? Was he formally in REO Speedealer?
More like LEO Speedwagon
NML
Well-Known Member
“This entire forum with a user base that’s been around for 20 years can’t give us a new owner... it’s definitely the forums and not us!”
I’m sure the OOTP forums that I’m constantly told can’t keep a league together are filled with dedicated owners who have just been waiting for a league that’s filled with dudes who think they’ve figured it out!
When that doesn’t work, I look forward to seeing what y’all blame next! It’s probably the indy devs fault
I’m sure the OOTP forums that I’m constantly told can’t keep a league together are filled with dedicated owners who have just been waiting for a league that’s filled with dudes who think they’ve figured it out!
When that doesn’t work, I look forward to seeing what y’all blame next! It’s probably the indy devs fault
Bdub
Well-Known Member
TonyGin&Juice
Sucking off Lawn Guy Land hobos.
I believe you mean LEO Fahgwagen.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
@TonyGin&Juice needs to up his recruitment effort. I have no doubt he can reach Schilling on schilling's level
All of it to become a care bear Indy devs care about.
Karl Hungus
Here to fix the cable
TonyGin&Juice
Sucking off Lawn Guy Land hobos.
No joke, I tried to recruit some guys from that NO FUN LEAGUE I got kicked out of but the schtick scared them off. Surprisingly it wasn’t me that turned them off but Wooly.
I haven’t used Twitter in over a decade. Do people actually still do responses or is it bot central in 2019?
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
That was my first tweet in three years, so he's probably got me filtered out as a bot/spam account
I’ve long said if there is no Radford Pear in the WBL I can’t abide
Sorry y’all, quitting is against the rules
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
NML pulled the classic NML schtick where he raised a bunch of questions, didn't really answer anyone's, threw out a few insults and then dipped out for a few days I think.
Bdub
Well-Known Member
Thank you sir!
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
I figured with this Galaxy set up that NML should rush Diplomacy traditions and specifically Federation builder, but this seems more like a Domination or Executive Vigor which is an interesting way to start a game
NML
Well-Known Member
Dude, I didn’t do any of this.
I was told that if I really wanted a new league, I should go recruit the owners and do the leg work, so I did. I laid out a plan to help improve owner retention, league balance, and forum activity. I never insulted anyone, y’all did that to urselves
There’s a core group that does not want to budge off the league. The giant disconnect is they think the league is pretty much fine as is. That’s cool - I don’t agree but it’s not my league so do you. I said that if they were interested they could send me a message so they didn’t have to get publicly blasted like I am.
The only people throwing insults are the current owners to people bringing up new ideas (me), newish owners who would like to see change (hayvis), and all the returners who are just constantly told that they are quitters (reel, schauwn, gator).
I’ve got one in The Daily Oklahoman scheduled for Wednesday, metrics tell me there will be calls from confused olds about why we should play baseball inside the park
hayvis
Will-Gnome Member
This confuses me :
This is a group friends playing a game, and one guy has asked if anyone wants to change the rules or start a new game because he's a bit bored of it (as were several others that quit) and everyone treats him like a he's a maniac.
Y'all acted like you've painted the sistine chapel, and he came in, took a dump and started smearing it everywhere. It's like the league itself has become more important than the people playing it.
I'm happy with anything really. I just think it's an excellent idea to discuss new ways which could make it more fun and accessible to play a game, and breath life into something that might have become a bit stale. The absolute strangest thing is that people are quitting because of this when it's the most normal thing in the world to do. I can understand quitting when something's boring and unchanging, but quitting when someone's trying to discuss ways of making it more fun is just weird.
This is a group friends playing a game, and one guy has asked if anyone wants to change the rules or start a new game because he's a bit bored of it (as were several others that quit) and everyone treats him like a he's a maniac.
Y'all acted like you've painted the sistine chapel, and he came in, took a dump and started smearing it everywhere. It's like the league itself has become more important than the people playing it.
I'm happy with anything really. I just think it's an excellent idea to discuss new ways which could make it more fun and accessible to play a game, and breath life into something that might have become a bit stale. The absolute strangest thing is that people are quitting because of this when it's the most normal thing in the world to do. I can understand quitting when something's boring and unchanging, but quitting when someone's trying to discuss ways of making it more fun is just weird.
To be fair, compared to most leagues on the internet it is the Sistine chapel even in its current form. Look at most leagues on the forums.
People who advocate for drastic change need a solidified plan laid out and evidence showing not only what that plan means long term but why it’s better. That’s the only way vets will budge because they’ve been through a lot of changes and if they aren’t fully fleshed out usually it’s a disaster down the road.
Since you guys can’t understand that part it seems like they’re unreasonable, but really they were open at first (while skeptical) and when they saw this wasn’t ready they said not right now
People who advocate for drastic change need a solidified plan laid out and evidence showing not only what that plan means long term but why it’s better. That’s the only way vets will budge because they’ve been through a lot of changes and if they aren’t fully fleshed out usually it’s a disaster down the road.
Since you guys can’t understand that part it seems like they’re unreasonable, but really they were open at first (while skeptical) and when they saw this wasn’t ready they said not right now
NML
Well-Known Member
Not really doe
I mean, I laid out more or less exactly what I would change. The league has a lot of solid things that we’ve worked through over the years, it just needs fine tuning. I presented a handful of new owners that were interested.
What I should’ve done was just started the league and then asked if any WBL members wanted in instead of asking for their input.
I mean, I laid out more or less exactly what I would change. The league has a lot of solid things that we’ve worked through over the years, it just needs fine tuning. I presented a handful of new owners that were interested.
What I should’ve done was just started the league and then asked if any WBL members wanted in instead of asking for their input.
hayvis
Will-Gnome Member
That's not quite true. They threatened to quit, dismissed most if not all of the ideas and then actually quit.
Also, I absolutely can't see the problem with everyone saying "yeah let's give it a go, but we'll carry on playing WBL until it's proven itself and we've hashed things out. And if it's a flop we'll ditch it" - Actually that is basically what @Travis7401 did say.
As I say, I'm happy with anything, I just find it confusing that people would have a problem with two leagues (at the very worst it would prove them right if it was a disaster). If we're staying in the WBL I would still love to see the new gimmicks introduced.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
The opinion that we didn't need a nuclear option was dismissed by you and NML.
But when you come in and take a giant dump on a league, you're going to rub the people that put work into that league the wrong way.
But when you come in and take a giant dump on a league, you're going to rub the people that put work into that league the wrong way.
Yankee151
Hot Girl Summer
The only idea any O or vet overall has dismissed is the one that a new league is necessary. We are open and actively working on every issue laid out in post #1 in this thread.
Surely you can see why insults may fly when everytime one of us says "here's maybe how we can fix that in the WBL, we will get started ASAP" its met with "you aren't listening to the problems at all! We need a new league!"
Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
Surely you can see why insults may fly when everytime one of us says "here's maybe how we can fix that in the WBL, we will get started ASAP" its met with "you aren't listening to the problems at all! We need a new league!"
Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
You missed the evidence part which is the most important. I never would have been able to convince Orlando or rad to do most of what we did without screenshots and explanations for them. I’m just telling you the way it goes, when we make changes that sound good but haven’t been tested it goes bad a lot. It took me a long time and all 15 other owners to get Rad to be okay with expansion and he really ended up being right that we probably shouldn’t have expanded.
But yeah just starting a new league would have led to the evidence because you’d have advanced 10-20 years and they could see what your vision looked like.
hayvis
Will-Gnome Member
You couldn't reinforce my point more. That's not what I've done, and neither has @NML . There's just been a discussion as to what people find fun and what people don't and what might be the solution.
How the fuck could I even take a dump on the league? I know I have no sway. You're all acting completely paranoid and threatening to quit/quitting over people making suggestions as to what could be more fun.
You're the one taking a dump on anyone that suggests anything new.
hayvis
Will-Gnome Member
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
NML
Well-Known Member
The evidence was the seven people who said they’d join a new league
Again - Rad and Yankee keep saying let’s just change the league which I have consistently said is fine... I gave the possible new owners list which was my only sort of leverage in the situation, and told y’all to go recruit them.
I guess making suggestions for changes to a new league or altering the WBL - which, btw, were almost universally accepted - and bringing a huge list of croots is taking a dump on the league?
Again - Rad and Yankee keep saying let’s just change the league which I have consistently said is fine... I gave the possible new owners list which was my only sort of leverage in the situation, and told y’all to go recruit them.
I guess making suggestions for changes to a new league or altering the WBL - which, btw, were almost universally accepted - and bringing a huge list of croots is taking a dump on the league?
Honestly I’m trying to be diplomatic and sharing what granted me success when I said we should create a new league. I was met with opposition from nearly everyone until I proved I could do it better (why I became the official commish at first). Everyone takes dumps on new ideas that aren’t proven because the nature of OOTP means that even small changes don’t necessarily work the way you think they should in your head.
If you think a new league is necessary provide real evidence as to why, without that there will be healthy skepticism about whether those changes will actually end up working.
So dumps will be taken until you prove it’s not a toilet
hayvis
Will-Gnome Member
@Mr. Radpants ; that post definitely does not dismiss tweaking the league to address the balance.
So prove your tweaks help with balance
hayvis
Will-Gnome Member
Threatening to quit and quitting is not healthy skepticism. It's blackmail. And as I said before, why can't people play both for a while and see if it's any good? I'm just finding all the posturing a bit sad.
Yes, create a new league to run along side the WBL with what you want and if it’s better I’d bet everyone that still likes playing OOTP would switch. If it’s a proven better product you won’t have any skepticism.