Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
Quoting this before Qual ninja edits to include our trade.
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2053 WBL Winter Meetings in Maui
- Thread starter Mr. Radpants
- Start date
Quoting this before Qual ninja edits to include our trade.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
He'll be out of luck when I murder him.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
Worst case is that I end up with no cash for 2054 and have to have another owner-manager forward Rad the cash in exchange for something.
That or I drive Buffalo into bankruptcy and am fired.
That or I drive Buffalo into bankruptcy and am fired.
Lloyd has been a noted attempted quitter when his fuckshit plans go awry on this site for years...
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
The options won't work, you have to turn a 6 million dollar profit this year apparently to have 6 million in cash.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
I'm gonna end up having to turn tricks in the alley outside the stadium for all my home games this year.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
Don't you'll worry.
If Rad doesn't end up with his $6M next year, dock me a future 1st rounder.
If Rad doesn't end up with his $6M next year, dock me a future 1st rounder.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
I really should have gotten the club finance guys involved in this negotiation.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
Quitting isn't allowed, plus that will be OOTP 50, the OOTP of Jubilee.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
Wait. So we can't trade draft picks we do own in salary dumps, but we can trade cash we don't yet have and may never have? Makes sense.
Well I think it depends on the financial situation the club is starting with. If you are in a good spot and currently have $10M in cash with large projected profits, then it is safe to say you are going to have $10M cash going forward.
Take my team for example. I currently have $10M cash carrying forward from last season. My budget is $124M and my payroll is $69M and my projected season earnings are higher than my current budget. If I want to guarantee $10M in cash I can because I've got so much wiggle room to make that happen. If I chose to set my scouting/dev to minimums, I'd be looking at a 60M+ buffer on my 2054 offer of $6M cash, so I think that's fair enough.
Now Lloyd is starting with $156k cash, meaning he has to make basically $6M in profit to ensure he has the cash next year. With a budget of 170M and a payroll of $163M (though that just decreased) he just doesn't have any margin of error there, even with minimum in scout/dev. Add in the fact that he'll probably lose $5M in rev sharing if he makes what he's projected... and I just don't see $6M profit. If he makes the playoffs it probably works out, but if he doesn't then he's sunk and we'll have to murder him in the next hunger games.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
And the fact that rad threw a tantrum about one and is involved in the other makes it so much better.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
I don't even like the rule that you got busted for breaking and never have. I would have been taking firsts for salary dumps for years if it had been legal.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
A bunch of these rules are due to Yankee taking it too far. We can tank, but we can't put position players in as pitchers. We can do cash dumps that involve draft picks, just not first rounders.
NML
Well-Known Member
I don't get this... Why not just do it now?
I just feel like offering something you don't have should be against the rules.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
It's against the rules now, Qual just made a rule.
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
I didnt vote for any rule!
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
I also don't even know what that trade accomplishes. Rad gets nothing out of it. A decent but nearing over the hill 1B and a late 2nd round pick? Lloyd in fleece city over there.
I vote for no rules. The salary cum dumpster routine is the worst trend in the WBL and the only rule we have on it actually makes it BETTER for the HAVES.
You can watch it happen live this season. JD is offering a full 5 year contract to a player he has no intention of keeping for the full 5 years and he's doing this because that's the length of the contract the player wants and this allows JD to offer a lower AAV than if he offered a 3 year contract or a 3+2 option year contract. We have an option year buyout rule to avoid the option year exploit, but what JD is doing is actually WORSE than the option year exploit because the player AI prefers the guaranteed contract. So after the 3rd or 4th year when JD decides BOYS is washed up, he'll just dump a hot load in the face of the next willing cum dumpster (and there are always willing cum dumpsters).
Now the only stupid fucking rule we have to "prevent" the cum dumping actually doesn't prevent it all (multiple dumps this offseason alone) it just prevents the dumpster from receiving proper compensation for the service. This is such a HAVE rule "oh sorry, I would give you a 1st for this but I cant because rules." I appreciate @Mr. Radpants for attempting to make people play by the established rules, but this rule is so stupid it actually hurts the HAVE NOTS. The rule doesn't prevent dumping at all, it merely prevents the dumpster from receiving a proper reach around in exchange for taking that load in the face.
To me, I'd rather just have no salary rules at all, to me. Do whatever the fuck you want. ALL'S FAIR IN LOVE, WAR, AND SIMULATION BASEBALL. What I hate is having a rule in spirit (ie the option year rule to avoid the long contract AI exploit) and watching someone trample all over the edge of that rule with both fingers in the air.
You can watch it happen live this season. JD is offering a full 5 year contract to a player he has no intention of keeping for the full 5 years and he's doing this because that's the length of the contract the player wants and this allows JD to offer a lower AAV than if he offered a 3 year contract or a 3+2 option year contract. We have an option year buyout rule to avoid the option year exploit, but what JD is doing is actually WORSE than the option year exploit because the player AI prefers the guaranteed contract. So after the 3rd or 4th year when JD decides BOYS is washed up, he'll just dump a hot load in the face of the next willing cum dumpster (and there are always willing cum dumpsters).
Now the only stupid fucking rule we have to "prevent" the cum dumping actually doesn't prevent it all (multiple dumps this offseason alone) it just prevents the dumpster from receiving proper compensation for the service. This is such a HAVE rule "oh sorry, I would give you a 1st for this but I cant because rules." I appreciate @Mr. Radpants for attempting to make people play by the established rules, but this rule is so stupid it actually hurts the HAVE NOTS. The rule doesn't prevent dumping at all, it merely prevents the dumpster from receiving a proper reach around in exchange for taking that load in the face.
To me, I'd rather just have no salary rules at all, to me. Do whatever the fuck you want. ALL'S FAIR IN LOVE, WAR, AND SIMULATION BASEBALL. What I hate is having a rule in spirit (ie the option year rule to avoid the long contract AI exploit) and watching someone trample all over the edge of that rule with both fingers in the air.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
I mean I think you probably just sold the rule to all the HAVES by accident, you could have just said that you want to vote to remove the rule and it would have probably passed.
Literally no one is in favor of the rule, even the guy who wrote it (OU), the guy who said it should be upheld (me), the guy that it was designed to protect (Yankee) and one guy who appeared to originally be for it (JD)
Literally no one is in favor of the rule, even the guy who wrote it (OU), the guy who said it should be upheld (me), the guy that it was designed to protect (Yankee) and one guy who appeared to originally be for it (JD)
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
I would explain what I think I get out of it but nah
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
I'll never deal BOYS if I get him back, so bite your tongue Travis.
Quick someone send me $10m cash this year and I'll send you $10m cash in 2055.
Quick someone send me $10m cash this year and I'll send you $10m cash in 2055.
NML
Well-Known Member
I'm not too stressed about the HAVEs trades. The bottom will fall out eventually. It happened with Cairo right before I took over. It's happening with Buffalo now. It will happen to FB soon enough.
Especially with the improved extensions and the quickly rising salaries - one bad season and things go wrong quickly.
Especially with the improved extensions and the quickly rising salaries - one bad season and things go wrong quickly.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
Also I'm not sure who I've gone out and signed to absurd contracts and then dumped? Sauce I got via trade. He was already signed to a long term deal and was worth the money before repeated injury. And this seasons "salary dump" I gave up massive value to accomplish, so I wouldn't even call it a straight salary dump.
Campbell is a Top 5 pitcher and I resigned him to his offer which was Top 10 pitcher money.
Karpetbomber I signed to a front loaded deal so I paid the expensive year of his contract. $10m for a 52 save guy isn't absurd.
You're cum dumpin just got me aroused, that's all @jdlikewhoa 
You are right about Sauce, that wasn't your dumb contract to begin with. I'm not saying this should be against the rules either, @Orlando is absolutely right that this is very common in reel life. I just think the "no 1sts" part of the rule is retarded. It doesn't prevent the practice, it only makes it less fair from the player taking on the bad contract.
I'm all for the only rule being "don't be an asshole" (ie shit only Yankee can come up with like putting 1B at pitcher). The second you start with rules, someone figures out the best way to toe the line and stay just on the right side of legal and it was a pointless exercise.
It is frustrating to me that the only real strict house rule we have (5 year contract limit on pre arb) is pretty punitive against the small budget teams. I admit that the pre-arb AI isn't great, but if we're going to go with a 5 year rule on pre-arb then what's good for the goose should be good for the gander and we should limit all contracts to 5 years. That way if you want to keep ur favorite player you'll have to renegotiate a few times as well.
You are right about Sauce, that wasn't your dumb contract to begin with. I'm not saying this should be against the rules either, @Orlando is absolutely right that this is very common in reel life. I just think the "no 1sts" part of the rule is retarded. It doesn't prevent the practice, it only makes it less fair from the player taking on the bad contract. I'm all for the only rule being "don't be an asshole" (ie shit only Yankee can come up with like putting 1B at pitcher). The second you start with rules, someone figures out the best way to toe the line and stay just on the right side of legal and it was a pointless exercise.
It is frustrating to me that the only real strict house rule we have (5 year contract limit on pre arb) is pretty punitive against the small budget teams. I admit that the pre-arb AI isn't great, but if we're going to go with a 5 year rule on pre-arb then what's good for the goose should be good for the gander and we should limit all contracts to 5 years. That way if you want to keep ur favorite player you'll have to renegotiate a few times as well.
Mr. Radpants
Trog Five Standing By
I have been a noted supporter of the 5 year limit on all contracts on this site for years.
@jdlikewhoa what about Bish?
I was going to mention that, but it might be legitimately un-dump-able like the RAT deal.
jdlikewhoa
Well-Known Member
I signed Bish knowing the contract is unmovable and that I'd have to ride it out. I don't think that has any bearing on this particular conversation.
If anything that contract has kept me interested. It's a bit challenging to have to make moves instead of just having $75m in salary room every offseason. Oh the struggles of a HAVE
If anything that contract has kept me interested. It's a bit challenging to have to make moves instead of just having $75m in salary room every offseason. Oh the struggles of a HAVE
Lloyd Carr
Well-Known Member
Anyone want Gonnett or Jihad?
NML
Well-Known Member
I'd take Gonnet off ur hands.
TonyGin&Juice
Sucking off Lawn Guy Land hobos.
Come on people, make me some offers. I'm sitting out here by the pool with too many whores and not enough cocaine to keep me here.
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I'll take Ryan Fuller